Game of Thrones season 2 ep 9 : The (almost) clueless about the books POV

[shapinglight]

Oh boy, oh boy!

Spoilers behind cut.



Not sure I have anything coherent to say beyond battle! Big, big battle!

No, wait. I'm sure I can do better than that.

Absolutely awesome episode, which must have blown the entire battle budget for the rest of the show, I should imagine, and very little of it CGI'd, except for that bloke getting his head sliced in half by Stannis, and even that may have been a model rather than CGI. Not that I was looking properly. Had to watch most of the battle scenes through my fingers with my eyes half shut.

Is that it, then, for Davos and his son? I don't see how they could have survived the wildfire. That whole sequence was so well done - quite horrible, right down to the barmy old mad scientist's look of satisfaction at the sight of all those burning ships and men. No wonder Tyrion looked appalled. Speaking of whom, if I didn't love Tyrion before, (which I did, of course), this episode cements his standing in my eyes as one of the best fictional characters ever. What a great speech he gave those men, and I bet that's the only time in his life he's been glad to see his father (not that he knows it was him, I suppose). I sort of guessed that Tywin might turn up and save the day when I saw Charles Dance's name in the beginning credits. I'm glad he arrived when he did and am intrigued to know when he teamed up with Loras, who was all full of righteous anger. Revenge! But Stannis got away, didn't he? I daresay he and Melisandre will cause more trouble down the line.

Lots and lots of great character scenes scattered among all the action - Tyrion/Varys (always a winning combination), Bronn/Tyrion (I love that they're still friends - or sort of - though clearly Bronn doesn't see it the same way Tyrion does), Cersei/Sansa (Cersei's scenes were all very unnerving, I really did think that Tywin would arrive too late to stop her killing Prince Tommen). I'd be interested to know how these scenes differ (if they do) from Cersei at this point in the book, because we learned a lot about her here, right down to her anger and frustration at her allotted role in life. Also that she probably shouldn't drink as she gets a bit indiscreet when she does.

Which leads me to the Hound/Sansa, I can definitely get on board that 'ship, I think, because there's surely no going back for the Hound after what he said to Joffrey, and I know that when he tells Sansa he won't hurt her, he really means it. It also means that, if they get away, nobody has a hostage any more. In fact, with Stannis defeated, Renly dead, the landscape of Westeros has changed profoundly yet again.

I'm now looking forward very much to the final episode, which I imagine will give us snapshots of what's going on with all the other characters - Jon Snow, Bran and Rickon, Brienne and Jaime, Robb and Catelyn, Arya and Jacquen and(hopefully) Dany and Jorah. If this season works like last, the final episode will include a lot of drama (I'm hoping that, like last season, a lot of it will centre around Dany), but will also position characters for the next season, because yet again the dramatic highpoint of the season has occurred in episode 9. In season 1, it was Ned's death, in season 2 this bloody great battle.

Okay, crap review. It was great. Roll on the finale (as long as they don't spend too much of it focusing on Robb and Wosserface).

Trivial stuff:

Rather a lot of female nudity, as usual. Bored enough of it now to wonder why on earth it is that Littlefinger's whores and the palace serving women all seem to wear the exact same dress. Weird.

Wilco Johnson has been playing Ser Ilyn Payne all this time? Blimey!

The Kingsguardsman who turned on Tyrion in the battle was probably supposed to be someone we recognise, but I'm afraid I didn't. Who was he?

Comments

[beer-good-foamy.livejournal.com]

Like I said elsewhere - The Hound's "Fuck the king" so counts as a slap. He's almost redeemed himself by now, hasn't he? And now Tywin gets to slap Joffrey next episode. Good times.

I agree, it was a great episode, even if I'm wondering how much they'll be able to tie up in the last episode (please don't tell me this means another season before karma catches up to Theon) and I'm guessing we'll get a few big cliffhangers in the finale. But hey, it's been renewed so roll on.

I thought Stannis got captured at the end, but I wasn't paying very close attention to the guards who dragged him away - might have been his own men, I suppose? But it seemed to me that he was basically a one-man army at that point.

Loras! Was that Renly's armour he was wearing? Awesome if so. And I guess that means he and his sister will still be in season 3. Though... did anyone else feel a bit weird cheering for Tywin Lannister showing up as a Big Damn Hero? Isn't he supposed to be the bad guy?

ETA: Oh, and who'd expected Lancel to be the most badass of the younger Lannisters? Well, maybe not the most badass, but he didn't run away and wet himself like some royals we could mention. Loved Cersei's speech on how she and Jaime were raised, too.

[shapinglight]

Like I said elsewhere - The Hound's "Fuck the king" so counts as a slap. He's almost redeemed himself by now, hasn't he?

Oh definitely. And with any luck, Tywin really will slap the little bastard next episode, because somebody should. Mind you, when Joffrey walked away, I thought that maybe Tyrion, though annoyed, also felt a teeny bit sorry for him. Joffrey's only a kid, after all - even if he is a nasty little sadist.

please don't tell me this means another season before karma catches up to Theon

Believe it or not, I'd forgotten about Theon. I'm pretty sure karma will catch up with him next episode though (hopefully, from what I've gathered from book readers) they won't make us watch in what way.

I think those were Stannis's own men dragging him away. Weren't they the blokes in the padded surcoats? I don't know if Loras was wearing Renly's armour, but it wouldn't surprise me. I'll have to check when I rewatch.

Though... did anyone else feel a bit weird cheering for Tywin Lannister showing up as a Big Damn Hero? Isn't he supposed to be the bad guy?

It's increasingly difficult to define 'bad guy' in this series. Apart from Tyrion. I rather like Tywin, have to say. It's because of all those great scenes with Arya, who he has doubtless forgotten about already.

[mrs-underhill.livejournal.com]

It's increasingly difficult to define 'bad guy' in this series
I realize the only reason I would cheer against King's Landing now is because of Jeoffrey.
Jeoffrey needs to get it, while I don't mind the rest of KL characters prevailing. And with Tywin coming in, even if JEoffrey will hang around he'll at least be taken in hand.

The other reason I'd cheer against KL is because I want Sansa to be free. And with Tywin and Tyrells in the picture, and Jaimie on the road, I'm not sure what could happen to her...

So it goes down to likes and dislikes of certain people. While on a global scale I'm with Varys, and I guess with Night Watch - whomever can bring peace and hold the realm together, I'll support.

[shapinglight]

So it goes down to likes and dislikes of certain people. While on a global scale I'm with Varys, and I guess with Night Watch - whomever can bring peace and hold the realm together, I'll support.

Yes, I'm with them too, and bizarre though it may sound, if Joffrey can be reined in effectively (and I hope Tywin won't be mean enough to tell Tyrion he hasn't done a good job, because he has as far as he can, but who knows what Cersei will say and which of them Tywin will choose to believe?).

[kikimay]

LOVED the battle and LOVED Tyrion, very much.
I don't know what to add, except maybe: OMG!!1! And "Somebody, please, kill Joffrey!" He's so annoying and I hate that Cersei always defends him. è_é
Who sing the final song? It's really beautiful.
Bronn and Tyrion for the win!

[shapinglight]

The song, I gather, was called The Rains of Castamere. I don't know who was singing it. Admit, I was rather thrown that whoever they were, they had an American accent.

Tyrion was utterly, utterly awesome in this episode. As for Cersei, I thought it quite telling that Tommen was the child she chose to spend what could have been her last few moments with. She may be all Mama Lion about Joffrey but I don't think even she likes him.

[shipperx.livejournal.com]

Aw Tommen: "Stags eat grass."

[shipperx.livejournal.com]

The Wildfyre explosion was impressive!

Yay, they didn't cut Tyrion's nose off!

Wish they'd made a bit more of Loras riding in on Renly's horse, in Renly's armor, and wearing Renly's helm. The 'ride of the "ghost" of Renly' always moved me.

Yeah, the nudity in the whorehouse was utterly pointless.

Exciting episode.

[shapinglight]

Yay, they didn't cut Tyrion's nose off!

Tyrion got his nose cut off? Aargh! I'm glad they missed that out. And agree with you about Loras. I wish I'd got the significance of that armour. It passed me by completely.

Yeah, the nudity in the whorehouse was utterly pointless.

If Bronn had got naked too I wouldn't complain so much. But anyway, I did enjoy his stories about the broken nose, just don't see why it had to be accompanied by stripping a girl naked.

Exciting episode.

It was exciting, and I have no idea what to expect next - except that if Tywin sees Shae - which he probably will - Tyrion is in big trouble, despite his heroics.

[shipperx.livejournal.com]

Yeah. At least part of it. That always bothered me terribly and I'd try to ignore it because -- ugghh!!! But I also always figured that the cost of having to digitally retouch every scene would make the nose lose rather cost prohibitive for the show. The scar was enough.

And there's a ton to do next week, because they've got to touch on everyone.

[mrs-underhill.livejournal.com]

Wish they'd made a bit more of Loras riding in on Renly's horse, in Renly's armor, and wearing Renly's helm

Ohh, really?! He was riding as a ghost of Renly? I would love for them to emphasise that, yes! Would love more tribute paid to the best pair and the best love story on the show, so far.
But then it would have spoiled the suprise, I guess. To see him show his face in the end was such a thrill.
But of he wants to take revenge on Stannis he'd have to get in line I guess.

I was thinking about Stannis losing legitimacy after what he did to Renly, which this episode demonstrated. But it also made me think of a strength of Renly's cause, or legitimacy of being wanted and accepted by a majority, which could compensate for weakness of his claim and the "frivolity", which is more of a book thing.
They made him much stronger in the show, with a real stance which people would support, not just a boy playing with pretty toys like in a book.

He could have a real shot just because people would want him to... Ah well. I wonder what would be Margeorie, and Tyrells, move now.

[shapinglight]

I agree Renly would have made a better king than just about any of the other contenders. Well, any of them, in fact, as I don't see Robb as king of all Westeros, and he doesn't seem to have any ambition to be so.

I can't guess what Margaery and Loras will do now. Margaery wants to be queen. Does that mean she'll want to marry Jeoffrey? She would handle him way better than Sansa, that's for sure.

I don't think Cersei would like her at all, though.

[shipperx.livejournal.com]

Yes the "Ghost of Renly" is one of those incidents that has legend built on it. In the wake of the battle there are all sorts of tales about how the Ghost of Renly rose up and fought back against his brother, etc. Of course the reader knows that the reality of it was that Loras went to war dressed as Renly, but as far as the populace/legend was concerned it was Renly's ghost.

[bogwitch.livejournal.com]

Hurrah for the pig shit! (I think).

[shapinglight]

Yes, it was pretty spectacular. Also, have only just cottoned on not only about Wilco Johnson but also that Wesley's dad Roy Dotrice was playing the mad old scientist.

[bogwitch.livejournal.com]

Well, it took me a season and a half to recognise Jerome Flynn and I'm still all really? about it now.

I knew Dotrice was in it, but I wasn't sure who he was playing. I'm listerning to the audiobook of the first book he narrated at the moment. He keeps mispronoucing things and keeps calling Joffrey, Jeffrey!

Am I supposed to know Wilco Johnson?

[shipperx.livejournal.com]

Roy Dotrice is the narrator of all but one of the audio books of ASOIF

[lyr]

If we're breaking the season where I think we are, I wouldn't stop covering your eyes just yet. But I could be wrong about where the break is going.

[shapinglight]

:Whimper:

Is this something to do with the Bastard of Bolton?

[lyr]

Not really; that's more a subject for later whimpering - a couple of seasons from now. Let this one be a complete surprise.

[flake-sake.livejournal.com]

I have not seen it yet, but I'm very much looking forward to it. That battle is awesomeness in wildfire bottle in the books. (The chain, the chain, do they have the chain??).

And the scenes with Sansa and the queen are so intense.

And I'm also so glad that they chose to forgo Tyrion losing his nose.

Can't wait to watch. And can't wait for the final. I think it'll focus on Dany, because there is a big scene still missing for her. And I guess Jon will also get some screentime in.

[shapinglight]

I hope you enjoy the ep when you see it. It really is wonderful. Definitely the best of this season, which I didn't necessarily think about GRRM's ep last season. I think they need to shake up the writing staff and for Benioff and Weiss to write fewer episodes themselves.

And I'm also so glad that they chose to forgo Tyrion losing his nose.

Me too. I wouldn't have liked that at all.

[mrs-underhill.livejournal.com]

This episode was superb!
So much happened which was unexpected and powerful.

Wildfire was horrific beyound what I could imagine, and you could see how everyone on the wall was shocked of what they did, except that maester and Jeoffrey, who were gleeful, to give Tyrion another reason to be shocked...

Wow, the break-up of Sandor Clegane was brilliantly done! He just had enough, especially of people burning around him. I'm not sure Sansa went with him though, it was left open-ended.

Tyrion was amazing, the little man who became a greatest hero. It was a poignant moment with Jeoffrey, who looked like a kid when he wanted to leave the battle. I even felt sorry for Jeoffrey then, and you could see Tyrion was too, and he just squared himself and took it all on his shoulders, and pulled it off!

But what was the most satisfacting to me is that Stannis FINALLY PAID A PRICE! For cheating with black magic. Yes, it felt like a cheap trick - to get rid of Renly so easily, but now I can see it's going to be very costly for him!
Not only he made some powerful enemies (hi Loras, was I ever glad, while suprised, to see you!), he also lost his legitimacy in the people's eyes.

Varys wants him dead and gone, and in this game you watch carefully what Varys wants, because he wants peace for the Realm and backs players who can bring it and destroys the others.
Varys declared Stannis a bad guy, and that's very bad news for Stannis! So, Varys became a eunuch due to dark arts. I read to that part in the book, and it's a really horrible story which I'm glad he didn't recite.

Stannis became a hate figure for a lot of people now, and for many viewers as well.
Yes, I cheered for Tywin and not just for Tyrion, but because I hate Stannis. I only hope Brienne can be around for her revenge. Maybe she and Loras can do it together somehow.

But I'm not sure what happened to Stannis - was he captured or dragged away by his own people?

Also didn't get where was Jeoffrey - I hoped he was killed when Lancel showed up alone in Cercei refuge but apparently not.
Also I think Lancel faked being shot by an arrow, to get a reason to leave the battle.

And back to whom Varys backs - I think he wants Jeoffrey on the Iron Throne even less than Stannis, and when he sold Ros to Cersei, it was to give Tyrion more room to dispose of Jeoffrey if he felt inclined to do so.

And the song which Cersei sang to Tommen - it had words about crown being on your little head or something like that. It sounded like a premonition of Tommen becoming a new king soon. One can only hope...

And what happened to Tyrion in the end? Looked like he was struck by someone from Tywin people or his own people?
My husband is now convinced that Tyrion is dead, because they killed the main hero Ned in the last season, and maybe they'd do it to a new main hero this season. I'm spoiled enough to suspect he survives, but with this show you can't be sure, it deviates from the books... And he wasn't in the preview for the finale. So crossing fingers for Tyrion.

So much else in there, superb scenes with Cercei and Sansa again, and it's gonna be hot for Shae now... As I assume she hasn't run away.

Can't wait for the finale, shapes up to be awesome!

P.S. I see Tywin getting Varys backing, as he's strong and rational enough to hold it together, except for the Stark issue.
Can't see how he can make peace with Starks now.
So maybe, in the end, everyone WILL be glad to see Danerys Targarean back, to sort everyone out?

And where is Robb? Isn't Robb on the way to take Casterly Rock from the Lannisters? And Harrenhall? It looks like every player will be moving bases...

And looks like Tywin did play Arya after all! Didn't he tell her he'd be marching against Robb's army in the previous episode? While he went into King's Landing.

[shapinglight]

This episode was superb!
So much happened which was unexpected and powerful.

Yes, I agree, though I do wish now that I'd cottoned on about Loras in Renly's armour at the time. I missed the significance of that completely.

I'm not sure Sansa went with him though, it was left open-ended.

It was, though her dropping the doll does suggest she's putting childish things behind her (though that could well mean she decides to stay in Kingslanding and become a player in her own right, who knows?)

I only hope Brienne can be around for her revenge. Maybe she and Loras can do it together somehow.

Yes, that would be nice, though I fear it won't happen for a while. I do think Stannis was dragged away by his own people and will live to fight another day.

And where is Robb? Isn't Robb on the way to take Casterly Rock from the Lannisters? And Harrenhall? It looks like every player will be moving bases...

I do wonder if the finale will begin with Tywin telling Cersei he polished off Robb on the way. But probably not.

And looks like Tywin did play Arya after all! Didn't he tell her he'd be marching against Robb's army in the previous episode? While he went into King's Landing.

Good point, which leads me back to thinking maybe Tywin's defeat of Robb is a fait accompli. Hmm.

[mrs-underhill.livejournal.com]

though her dropping the doll does suggest she's putting childish things behind her
Isn't that the doll which Ned tried to give her to console her after killing Lady? And she violently rejected it, saying "I didn't play with dolls since 8" or something like that? I might check that episode.

If that is the same doll then it might be revenge which is on her mind? She might be staying for Ned's memory, to see Stannis put Lannisters to sword or something like that?

Good point, which leads me back to thinking maybe Tywin's defeat of Robb is a fait accompli.
Don't think that AT ALL.

What I thought happened was that Tywin willingly risked his lands to secure KL.
In the previous episode, he was talking with his advisor about it, that Robb is about to strike at his lands. The advisor was saying something like - Robb doesn't have all the forces, he won't risk attacking you. And Tywin was saying - oh no, he would risk anything, and he could pull it off.
And still he went to rescue KL. I saw it as trading a win for a loss, a willing risk. Same as Robb, Tywin sees Robb as an equal.

That's why I think we'll see some kind of an exchange - Tywin losing his base and gaining KL, while Robb losing Winterfell (and maybe Frey bridge) but gaining Lannister base. Both are going va bank.