Game of Thrones ep 9 (the clueless about the books POV)

[shapinglight]

Just watched Game of Thrones ep 9 and...

Spoilers within



...oh dear! That was very upsetting. I did think it was very unlikely that Ned would last the season, but all the same, that was quite horrible. Poor little Arya, and poor, poor Sansa. Joffrey is just such an obnoxious little git! Seems from the way the execution scene was staged that even his mother was taken aback by his decision. Unless it was an act, of course. People have hinted at such awful things about Cersei that it wouldn't surprise me.

Elsewhere, the Dothraki scenes were equally, if not more, horrible. Didn't like them at all. And slightly disappointed that even GoT goes with the old cliche of women who go into labour instantly being convulsed in agony. It really doesn't work that way. I don't know what to expect of that storyline at all now. If Dany loses the baby, will she also lose Khal Drogo's affection? That is, if he isn't dead himself, or only exists as some sort of zombie. Either way, I don't see how Dany will maintain any hold over the Dothraki, and perhaps she doesn't, but then what happens to her?

Don't tell me, btw. Don't want to be spoilered. I'm just speculating.

Apart from the above mentioned nastiness, there was a lot of good stuff in the episode. Jon Snow's scene with Master Aemon was terrific (and now I've remembered, that actor played Wolfie Smith's girlfriend's dad in Citizen Smith. How odd). I can't decide what decision Jon is likely to make. I suppose the final episode will tell us. Then there's Tyrion. Every scene of his was a delight, and - apart from her propensity to strip naked at the least provocation - thank goodness this Shae person isn't much like the annoying Roz. I liked her, and I particularly liked the 'game' scene, where Tyrion failed to learn a single thing about her, while giving away almost everything about himself. Also, Bronn's face is just priceless. They can't have too many scenes together as far as I'm concerned.

I can't really guess what might happen in the final episode, except that the Starks' capture of Jaime Lannister will feature strongly in it. I don't know about Lord Tywin, but Cersei won't want anything to happen to him. Maybe Robb will manage to exchange Jaime for his sisters? Or maybe King Robert's brother will come along and complicate things even further? Whatever happens, no one has their eye on the Wall, and that's probably a very bad thing.

One final thing: are we supposed to have recognised the man in the crowd who exchanged looks with Ned and then grabbed hold of Arya? I'm sure we were supposed to, but I have no idea who he is.

Also, in one of my previous reviews, I made predictions about various things happening, and so far they all have. :is a bit smug:

Comments

[queenofthorns.livejournal.com]

You are correct in thinking that Cersei was also totally surprised and shock by what Joffrey decides to do to Ned - you can see her arguing with him and she has to look away when the sword falls. That was totally offscript.

The guy whom Ned recognizes and who "rescues" Arya is Yoren, the Night's Watch recruiter who brought Ned word of Catelyn's capture of Tyrion back in Episode 5. Because he said that Benjen is his "brother", Ned sort of hopes that he may help Arya - it's the only thing he can do for her after he sees her. (I'm surprised his eyes work so well in daylight after being in the dark for so long ;P) But Yoren is REALLY there because he's supposed to take Ned into custody and bring him back to the Wall after Ned confesses his treason - but Joffrey, of course, nixes all that.

[shapinglight]

That was totally offscript.

It looked it, but after what I've seen people say about Cersei it wouldn't have surprised me if it had been an act for Sansa's benefit. I'm glad it wasn't, because I'd rather the show made her less evil than she apparently is in the books.

Actually, her wanting Ned spared wouldn't be a decision she reached because of an impulse to be merciful, I don't think. It would be a pragmatic, hard-headed decision about what's best for her son. Sparing Ned and exiling him to the Wall would have been a good way to pull the teeth of the rebellion. Oh well.

And thanks for the info about Yoren's identity. I would never have remembered that.

[shipperx.livejournal.com]

The man in the crowd was around before but there are so many characters on the show that it's easy to have no idea who he is.

He's the 'recruiter' from the wall that Tyrion was joking with early in the show who also came back south with Tyrion in order to bring back new recruits. He met with Ned a few episodes ago about needing new recruits for the wall, so Ned recognized him. Who knows, maybe he had once been from the North as well. That's never made clear, but he was someone we saw interact with Ned a few episodes ago (but so many characters are difficult to differentiate.)

I was wondering how they were going to slip in the information about Tyrion's backstory with his wife Tysha. I suppose medieval 'truth or dare' is better than hooker sexposition.

Shae (the girl brought to Tyrion) is nothing at all how I imagined... which is intriguing.

And I've grown to really enjoy Bronn both in the show and in the books, though he's remained a rather tertiary character, he's one that I appreciate. (There's this small, off-screen thing he does in Book 4 that made me laugh and want to throw my arms around him and hug him).

Also, even knowing Ned's death was coming they staged it so well that I think it worked better here than in the book. This is the first time his death made me want to cry. Poor Arya and Sansa indeed.

(And when in doubt about Cersei just assume that she is the most selfish, self-involved shrew possible and it more or less fits her POV chapters).

[queenofthorns.livejournal.com]

(And when in doubt about Cersei just assume that she is the most selfish, self-involved shrew possible and it more or less fits her POV chapters).


But she's not stupid - you can see Cersei arguing with him and looking away when the sword falls. This is not something she anticipated. The show's Cersei is a lot more complex than the book's, but even in the book, it's clear that Joffrey went off-message there. It's of no benefit to Cersei to have Ned dead, rather than a self-confessed traitor at the Wall. And now that the Starks have Jaime, the Lannisters have also sacrificed a valuable bargaining tool in getting Jaime back.

[queenofthorns.livejournal.com]

Oh, I forgot to add that actually the only part of the episode that made me tear up was Catelyn watching the battle and her tearing up when she Robb ride out unscathed. Sniffle! I love her.

[shipperx.livejournal.com]

No, I agree. I think Joffrey went off script. That wasn't her plan. And I hope they do give her some more depth than in the books because I agree with a lot of the reviews in that allowing us inside Cersei's head was not to the character's benefit with the way that she's written in Book IV (I think Jaime at one point thinks of her as having wits but no patience, which may well be true.) She was far more intriguing before we knew the relentlessly selfish stuff rattling around in her head.

[shipperx.livejournal.com]

I think the show has been of service to both Catelyn and Robb. We actually get to see some of Robb's badass on the show rather than 'hear' about it, and the actress playing Catelyn does a fine job of showing all of Catelyn's facets.

[queenofthorns.livejournal.com]

Conversely, I think they've done a lousy job showing why Jaime is such a feared warrior. There's no indication that he's anything special on the show, which is a pity.

[shapinglight]

I suppose medieval 'truth or dare' is better than hooker sexposition.

Definitely. I loved that scene. Was it not in the book? And how does this Shae differ from how you imagined her?

And I've grown to really enjoy Bronn both in the show and in the books, though he's remained a rather tertiary character, he's one that I appreciate. (There's this small, off-screen thing he does in Book 4 that made me laugh and want to throw my arms around him and hug him).

It's his facial expressions that get me, along with the flat, laconic deliverance. Very, very funny.

Also, even knowing Ned's death was coming they staged it so well that I think it worked better here than in the book. This is the first time his death made me want to cry. Poor Arya and Sansa indeed.

I was near tears too, which hasn't happened before in this show. Didn't cry over the direwolf in ep 2. Poor Sansa! She really thought she'd saved her father. I do hope that this has finally opened her eyes to the truth about Joffrey.

[shapinglight]

That was a very good scene. I like her very much too, though I had to roll my eyes a little when she said the lord of that bridge place would never harm her. Turns out she was right this time, though, after being so spectacularly wrong about Baelish - who I notice was the only one of the party gathered around the king in the execution scene who didn't try to remonstrate with him.

I wonder why that could be? :cynical font:

[flake-sake.livejournal.com]

I loved the episode, there were several things I was worried about and they did them lovely.

I see other folks have already clued you in about Yoren. By the time this happens in the books I had totally forgotten about him too. I liked how they did it though, with Ned whispering Baelor and her sitting on the statue of Baelor the Blessed.

Also the way you could see that Joff totally went off on everyone, the little bastard. Even Cersei would have had Ned go to the wall and made peace with the Starks.

I was so relieved at how they told the Tysha story (not as sexposition) and at how they did Shae. She's a lot like I imagined her from the books and there I really liked her for the most part. It's easy to see, why Tyrion likes her and much better than Ros.

I can't wait for next season and currently rereading the second book and you're going to love it! It has so many completely delicious Tyrion scenes in it.

The Dothraki plot is ugly at this stage. I pretty much hated the implications of it. But in the end it does make Dany's story a lot more interesting in the rest of the story.

[flake-sake.livejournal.com]

The scene before she goes in is her POV in the books. When she says he won't harm her, she thinks herself what the Greatjon says (unless there's a profit in it for him). She just means to downplay it to Robb so he lets her go instead of going himself or sending someone who'll start another war.

She knows she's the right combination of powerful and unvaluable as a prisoner to do the job.

[flake-sake.livejournal.com]

I think Robb openly saying he'd lose if they duel did a good job with transporting Jamie's reputation.

[shipperx.livejournal.com]

Not the truth or dare part. He did at various times give the backstory about Tysha to Bronn and later to Shae, so I guess they chose to simply have him tell them both at once. I think that the 'truth or dare' set-up made it more organic than his simply blurting it to Bronn but slightly less organic than how he told Shae in a later book.

And how does this Shae differ from how you imagined her?
Well, we only ever see Shae through Tyrion's eyes in the books and he's a bit besotted so it was never an objective view. In his eyes, though, he repeatly refers to her as sweet natured... and that's not the vibe that this Shae gives off (though I'm intrigued by her and the way they're playing it).

It's clear in the book that Tyrion is seeing her quite subjectively, so it's not necessarily so much a change in character so much as the audience developing a view of her rather than only seeing her through Tyrion's eyes. But because of Tyrion's repeated comments about her being sweet and gentle... I just expected her to be a bit different. I could like the change though, so I'm not complaining.

Poor Sansa, indeed. She's now essentially a hostage, just as Jaime is with the Starks. It's going to be a long, bloody war.

[shapinglight]

I liked how they did it though, with Ned whispering Baelor and her sitting on the statue of Baelor the Blessed.

Yes, I managed to get that bit and was quite pleased with myself.

Even Cersei would have had Ned go to the wall and made peace with the Starks.

It would have been the politic thing to do. Joffrey is obviously stupid as well as mean.

Interesting that you say Shae is how you imagined her in the books. shipperx says the opposite. Either way, I like her and will happily see a lot more of her.

The Dothraki plot is ugly at this stage. I pretty much hated the implications of it. But in the end it does make Dany's story a lot more interesting in the rest of the story.

It's definitely the hardest storyline to get along with and is also the one where I can't even begin to guess what might happen next. I had thought that maybe Khal Drogo would die and that Dany would spend the rest of the series plotting to get their son on the throne of Westeros, but if she's going to lose the baby clearly that won't happen. But if she loses the baby and Khal Drogo dies, then the Dothraki won't follow her so I just don't know where she'll go from here.

[shipperx.livejournal.com]

Jaime is a bit hindered because in Book I and II he's seen at...well... sort of a distance. The scenes he's in are memorable, but few and far between. It would've been cool to have seen the Robb/Jaime battle, but for budget reasons they're trying to avoid those (which they also did to Tyrion. It was rather ignimonious for him to be knocked out before even leaving the tents when in the book he was allowed to be reasonably effective).

They did slip in a sword fight for Jaime/Ned. In GoT and CoK we do hear more about Jaime being badass than actually see it. I'm still wondering how they're going to handle him next season. Maybe they can add something next year since in the book he's sidelined for quite some time.

[shapinglight]

Ah. That makes sense. I rather enjoyed the mean old bridge lord (another well known British character actor whose name escapes me).

[shapinglight]

and that's not the vibe that this Shae gives off (though I'm intrigued by her and the way they're playing it).

No, I wouldn't describe her as 'sweet' either. She seems quite hardbitten, though in a different way to Roz. I like her, though. She has an intriguing air of mystery and hidden depths.

Poor Sansa, indeed. She's now essentially a hostage, just as Jaime is with the Starks. It's going to be a long, bloody war.

I hope that at least she won't have to marry the king.

[shapinglight]

It was rather ignimonious for him to be knocked out before even leaving the tents when in the book he was allowed to be reasonably effective).

Really? Poor old Tyrion! Mind you, that was a very effective speech he gave.

[flake-sake.livejournal.com]

Interesting that you say Shae is how you imagined her in the books. [info]shipperx says the opposite. Either way, I like her and will happily see a lot more of her.


Shae totally invites to project things unto her. I have a good friend who is like that and Shae reminds of her a great deal. Tyrion in the books projects things on her I did not really agree with, but she always seems like there is more to her. I like how quickly they established that in the show. And also the way she talks with Tyrion. She might only give him what he wants but at least she recognizes that he prefers it square.

I love the dysfunctional little family unit Bronn and Shae form around Tyrion, dealing with the hostility of his own family (save Jaimie).

[shipperx.livejournal.com]

Yeah, he did surprisingly well... which really screwed with dear old dad's plans.

Tywin had Tyrion and his band of buggered in place thinking that they would collapse as the weak point in the line and then his own men surround them and pick off Robb's men. Only Tyrion and his band didn't just collapse. (I do believe Tyrion was actually hurt in the battle though.) But Tyrion was actually effective in the book.

However the producers have said that they really don't have the budget for big battle sequences so they're clearly doing all they can to creatively stage them so that they don't actually have to show it. Those sorts of scenes are expensive with a bunch of extras.

[mrs-underhill.livejournal.com]

I've been meaning to join the discussion for some time, I'm absolutely enthralled with the series now and that last episode was a shocker!

And I almost gave up on it after the 1st episode as I was grossed out by gratitous sex and violence and didn't really like any of the characters - but the settings were gorgeous and the Wall and things beyound it really struck imagination.
So I stuck around for the Wall and boy was I rewarded! As everyone came to life and many layers were uncovered in the show. Majestic adaptation, book fans must be so happy! Not sure I'll read the books though, unless 2nd season will be too far off. Wouldn't enjoy mua-ha-ha bitch Sersei for sure, she's so interesting in the show.

[mrs-underhill.livejournal.com]

Now to the episode. Well what did you know - Sersei and Robert marriage DID hold the kingdom together, it's amazing how everything went to hell after his death.
Loved Tirion's face in the last episode when hearing about all the madness ensuing from his capture. To think that all this crap started because of him - oh boy.
Also I refuse to believe the swordmaster is dead... They didn't show it, maybe he escaped somehow? Hardly...

Ned's death was SHOCKING. I didn't expect that at all, Jeoffrey really is a disgusting scum and the intriguing thing is - how Sersei would react to it, would she stand behind her son or his daddy/her brother/lover, after she learns about Jamie's capture. Jeoffrey with his stupidity and cruelty might have just signed death warrant for Jamie, or at least guaranteed him a very miserable life.
Whom Sersei loves more, would she try to slap some sense into her son? Or go with him?
Did she create a monster she can't control and would Jeoffrey turn on her too if she tries to curb him to save Jamie?

Another conflict we might see is if Jamie and Tirion ever meet again and Tirion would know about Jamie making Bran a cripple. I feel it will be hard to stomack by Tirion, and yes, he might have seen it all and become cinical just like his father tried to make him, but he's still a young naive boy at heart, as Shae said.

LOVED their game in the tent, and Bron. At first I thought Shae might be a spy, kind of like Mata Hari, with her being from a noble family from abroad - and from where, in fact? I think she's from the part of the Kingdom we haven't seen yet and maybe another major player, and I love how they keep putting the new places on the map.
But now I think her family was killed in a war or something. Something like a story of that blind Targarean on the Wall. She's interesting, love to see more of her.
Tirion' marriage story was horrible. His father is a bastard. And his brother seems to try things for the best for those his loves, with them always ending up badly, like with Tirion here.

And now for the bastard son Lord Snow choice. No doubts he'll choose the Wall and the duty. It was emphasied many times that what is happening north of the Wall is the most important, that someone should think of the realm and should get above the petty squabbles of warring clans - which is what Lanisters and Starks are doing, and prepare to face the real horror.
I hope Lord Snow has it in him to stay.

Interesting how they keep returning to Family, Duty, Honour and which shoudl come first. According to what Bran read about Starks, their priorities should be like the above, but Ned always put honour above everything else (see him refusing to kill Dana despite his duty, or decisions he made which were dangerous to his family).
It was so painful to see him throw away honour and duty in his last confession speech, for the sake of his family, his daughters - and seeing it coming to nothing, not helping his daughters, or his son.
And the realm would have the horrible Jeoffrey at the helm because Ned wasted a chance to make his secret public.

I'm really afraid for Sansa now. Not sure she could get out the marriage - Jeoffrey is so vile he could force her to marry him just out of sadism. There was a little preview of the next episode - not sure you'll get them in UK, which had glimpses of this being addressed, could go either way.
Also have to say I really like Sansa, liked it more than Arya in the beginning as Arya seemed a tomboy stereotype thrown out to appease feminists, while Sansa was a girl who was trying be good at being a woman - she likes to make pretty things, dreams about being a perfect lady with a perfect knight - a choice which I don't like to see diminished.
But then I loved Arya too - after that awful direwolf business. Still I root for Sansa and think she's in for very nasty things... And as for marrying Arya to that bridge guy's son - you gotta catch her first, heh.

There's just so much going on, and it's superbly filmed, acted, plotted - no words. Except yes, they do go overboard with porn, like in the sexposition in the last episode. But my husband, eh, enjoyed it... And we gals did get that delicious and tasty gay scene with Renli, so OK, I'll let it pass just this once.

[shapinglight]

Majestic adaptation, book fans must be so happy! Not sure I'll read the books though, unless 2nd season will be too far off. Wouldn't enjoy mua-ha-ha bitch Sersei for sure, she's so interesting in the show.

I think we'll probably have to wait a whole year for the second season, but I don't think I'll read the books despite that. I expect Cersei will still turn out to be pretty evil, but at least in the show she's multi-layered evil.

[shapinglight]

:waves: Hi, Nata. Glad you're enjoying the show. Must admit, I love it, even though there have been times when I couldn't watch (not keen on the extreme violence, and the sex gets boring after a while).

I was expecting Ned to die. Had probably vaguely gathered it was going to happen from someone who is book-spoilered, but also couldn't see any other outcome for him. If only Robb had managed to get hold of Jaime Lannister earlier it might have been different. I agree with you about Sansa. I love the character. She was so brave in the previous episode when she pleaded for her father's life, and so sure, when Ned made his forced confession that she had saved him. And I'm sure he only said what he said to spare his girls the sight of his death, and it didn't work. So tragic, the whole thing, not to mention he endorsed Joffrey's kingship which is the last thing anyone needs. What a horrible can of worms. I love it.

I agree about Shae. She was very interesting. I like the trio of Tryion, Bronn and Shae very much and hope we see more of them.