Fic Writing Whinge

[shapinglight]

Haven't done one of these writing whinges posts for a while. Haven't posted anything, in fact. I don't know why it's so much harder these days. Anyone else finding that?

Anyway, brief stuff about fic writing behind cut.



I always think I've run out of ideas for fanfic, but then something else comes along - or in this case, comes back again. I've spent the last couple of weeks writing a story that I'd written the first couple of pages of years ago but never got any further with. Not sure why I started it in the first place, to be honest, and even less sure why I suddenly felt inspired to write it.

It's a Darla fic, and that's another thing I'm never sure of - why I like this ghastly woman so much. Because she is, isn't she? Ghastly, I mean. Manipulative, greedy, cruel, etc, etc.

But I just like her. I ju-ust do. I come back to her over and over. So here I am writing her again, and what's more the story is rather dark, which I have written a lot before, of course, but also femslash, which I haven't, and which I'm quite nervous about. Probably done it all wrong. Probably shouldn't post it at all. In fact, should I?

That's far more of a vexed question these days than it used to be (or so it seems to me, I could well be wrong, my fandom experience is pretty much limited to Livejournal, Dreamwidth and a couple of Buffy fan forums these days, and Fandom, as we know, has moved on from those places).

Thoughts, anyone?

Mind you, the question is moot no matter what if I can't make the story fit to post in the first place.

Comments

[ex_peasant441]

Are you worried you can't get into the emotions of femslash properly or something? Don't be daft. You also aren't a gay man yet you write plenty of male slash.

Doubtless people have written entire PhD theses about why writers enjoy writing horrible people. My personal theory is it is part because cultural expectation and story convention and balance makes it both required and useful to the way we generally write. And part just because we can, and writers love to experiment. Nasty people are more creative to write about since most people we actually know tend to be normal and relatively nice and benign. So for fantasy writers in particular it gives us that extra move away from reality that we require for fiction to interest us. Everyone can understand nice people, nasty people present challenges.

[shapinglight]

You also aren't a gay man yet you write plenty of male slash.

True, but I'm reasonably certain that my m/m slash bears very little resemblance to real, actual male gay relationships. In fact, that's probably true of most m/m slash.

I suspect I just like writing Darla because I can put her in interesting historical places and costumes. ;)

[trepkos.livejournal.com]

I have been completely uninspired for a couple of years - very depressing.

[shapinglight]

:(

I do keep thinking I've probably written everything I'm going to write fanfic-wise. But then some idea or other turns up. Hopefully, the same will happen to you.

[sibilant.livejournal.com]

I like to read your nasty characters and dark plots as much as you like to write them. My feeling has always been that life is generally so safe and predictable that we need to feed that nasty part of the id; the one that wants violence, dominance and cruelty. Let it all out in some harmless fantasy and then get back to being a (very)civil servant! And of course vampires are so useful for these purposes, with their ability to recover from (almost) anything ...

Whatever the reason, I enjoy your dark places and look forward to another helping of vicious, sneering, girly Darla. Femslash is a different look for you, but it's not like you've shied away from slash in the past. Please don't let concern about that stop you from posting.

[shapinglight]

Nah, I probably won't. I'll only shy away from posting (somewhere anyway) if the story is just no good. Which, ultimately, will be down to someone else to tell me, I suppose. ;(

I'm sure you and dwyld are right. Nasty characters are a kind of safety valve, both in fiction and on TV. You can enjoy them knowing they're fictional and can't do any real damage to anyone. Also, writing/acting villains is just fun. It just is.

[red-satin-doll.livejournal.com]

why I like this ghastly woman so much.

I don't see how that's any different to the vast swathes of fandom that adore Angelus, (soulless) Spike, Killgrave (from Jessica Jones), Hannibal Lecter, and all manner of villainous male characters. You can explore things that another character mightn't allow you to, and no harm done.

[shapinglight]

Exactly.

[elisi]

I don't know why it's so much harder these days. Anyone else finding that?
I find that I'm writing AUs full of original characters, or original fiction fullstop. I think it's the lack of new show material.

It's a Darla fic, and that's another thing I'm never sure of - why I like this ghastly woman so much. Because she is, isn't she? Ghastly, I mean. Manipulative, greedy, cruel, etc, etc.
One of my favourite characters to write for is Illyria, hands down. And the Master/Missy. I find them a delight to write, which should probably worry me... Although at time like that, I tend to fall back on this - it's from 'Thrones, Dominations' by Dorothy L. Sayers. The main character, Harriet, is an author, and newly married):

The first thing that happened was the realisation that the new story was going to be a tragedy. Previous books, written while their author was struggling through a black slough of misery and frustration, had all been intellectual comedies. The immediate effect of physical and emotional satisfaction seemed to be to lift the lid off hell. [...] She was a little startled, and (rather apologetically) brought this interesting psychological paradox to Peter [her husband] for treatment. His only comment was: 'You relieve my mind unspeakably.'

Probably shouldn't post it at all. In fact, should I?
Oh course you should!

[shapinglight]

I don't know why it's so much harder these days. Anyone else finding that?
I find that I'm writing AUs full of original characters, or original fiction fullstop. I think it's the lack of new show material.

Hmm, I think I was probably not very clear when I first made this post. I didn't mean so much that I'm finding it hard to post fanfic, more that I'm finding it hard to post at all. ;)

The lack of new show material doesn't really bother me where BtVS is concerned. I didn't start writing fanfic until AtS was over anyway. In fact for me, closed canon is far better.

One of my favourite characters to write for is Illyria, hands down. And the Master/Missy. I find them a delight to write, which should probably worry me...

It doesn't really worry me, just puzzles me a bit. I'm sure if I met anyone like Darla in RL (well, not a centuries old vampire, but manipulative, greedy, cruel etc) I'd loathe her. But writing her is just fun.

[dragonyphoenix.livejournal.com]

I also have had trouble with motivation lately. In fact, I'm procrastinating as I write this! ;-)

When I first started writing fanfic, my mother had recently passed away and I was clinically depressed. I was in a very bad headspace, partly due to me and partly due to dysfunction at the office. My writing bad characters and bad situations was a way of coming to terms with people and issues at the office. Therapy was actually more helpful in that but this was before therapy and possibly it's what helped enough to allow me to get therapy.

[shapinglight]

My post (which I realise now was unclear) wasn't so much trying to say it's hard to post fanfic these days but more it's hard to post anything at all. ;)

Lots of stuff I just don't want to talk about, and other stuff I think people won't be interested. I dunno. I'm pretty sure I used to talk about everything.

I'm glad you found writing fanfic therapeutic. I think I do too, though for different reasons.

[braxen.livejournal.com]

Of course you should post it! If it wants to be written, there is something in you that needs to explore it and there is a good chance that there will be (many) others who feel the same way. If it doesn't work out as well as you'd like it to - well, it doesn't have to. Reading fanfiction lets one (to some extent) take part in someone else's creative process, that in itself is really interesting. To me being a part of the fanfiction community is a lot about sharing ideas and angles.

I also think that playing the evil angle from a safe distance holds a strong attraction. In all the TV shows I've watched where a character has a "dark counterpart" the actors always seem to enjoy themselves thorougly and even play their part better than usual having fun, fun, fun. We all have a dark side and I think we all feel its pull, this is a way to explore that side without actually giving in to it. IMO that is a very healthy thing to do. Know yourself. :)

[shapinglight]

I also think that playing the evil angle from a safe distance holds a strong attraction. In all the TV shows I've watched where a character has a "dark counterpart" the actors always seem to enjoy themselves thorougly and even play their part better than usual having fun, fun, fun.

This is true. For one thing, you could hardly call what David Boreanaz does with Angel in BtVS acting until he gets to play evil. He's having a ball, and it shows.

[rbfvid.livejournal.com]

Well, I dunno... Writing an unapologetically evil character feels like the most liberating thing to me )
Besides, are you aware that you have written some quality femslash before? It wasn't the major part of the plot, but whenever you wrote Darla and Drusilla interaction, it felt very femslashy, and exactly in the right way (Venus and Mars, Ennui).

[shapinglight]

but whenever you wrote Darla and Drusilla interaction, it felt very femslashy, and exactly in the right way (Venus and Mars, Ennui).

That's very nice to hear, though it's a lot more explicit (and possibly less explicable) in what I've just written.

Writing evil/amoral characters is a liberating thing. Those of you who've said that in comments on this thread are quite right.

[lyr]

Post it!

[shapinglight]

I will, I will!

Not just yet, though. Read it through last night and it's need a lot of work before it's ready.

[chasingdemons.livejournal.com]

I think every time someone drops out of the fandom or it slows down another notch it becomes self perpetuating. But just to clarify, I miss your posts very much and I'm sure there are many other people who feel the same. I've been wondering what's going on with you, and would be interested in anything you want to post. But only if you want to.

I also love your dark fics, and miss that as well. After all, the show has a lot of vampires In it. And vampires are evil. Sometimes I think people forget that. As far as writing femslash, I think if you convey the feelings (lust, passion, fear, whatever) it works no matter what gender is involved. And you are very good at conveying feelings.

[shapinglight]

I think every time someone drops out of the fandom or it slows down another notch it becomes self perpetuating.

You are quite right. There is stuff going on on Tumblr, of course, but the way conversations occur on that site is so ridiculous I just can't cope with it. :(

I do need to try and post more. Definitely. Meta-wise, though, I feel I've said pretty much everything I have to say about the Buffyverse, unless you count comics reviews. Even on Tumblr, the conversations aren't about anything we haven't discussed here ad infinitum in the past. ;)

Same on fan forums. The same arguments keep going around again, and again, and again.

Re: what's been going on with me, I've sent you a PM, as this is an open post. It's nothing too dramatic - not this year anyway.

I do like posting. I like to post. So my reluctance rather takes me by surprise. It's odd.

I also love your dark fics, and miss that as well.

Yeah, my stories have become a lot fluffier in recent years, I know. I'm not sure if it's an age thing or what. ;) I also can't be bothered with sex scenes in fic any more and usually skip them, which is probably why I no longer write them. Not sure when that happened.

That's an idea for a meta post actually. Though I'm sure it's been done before, and if someone posted something like that back when I was writing a lot of dark, rather extreme slash, it probably annoyed the hell out of me. ;)

[yourlibrarian]

So, regarding Darla, I actually quite enjoy reading about her, because the biggest thing I take away from Darla is that she gives no fucks about what anyone else thinks (although she's smart enough not to burn bridges she might need). She was a woman who had to struggle for everything she got and she was not afraid to reach out and take things when they were within her grasp and they pleased her.

I remember when my friend began watching Buffy she couldn't stand Darla. I told her "Just wait" because I thought Darla's arc was quite interesting. And she ended up agreeing -- she might not be her favorite character but she ended up liking her just as much as many other characters.

So I would think she's a great character to write because she offers so many possibilities. You could never be quite sure what Darla might do next.

As to posting, there's not as much of a readership as there used to be for the fandom in general but I think there's still quite a few people who are interested in reading more about the Buffyverse.

I'd also recommend posting at AO3 because while it's possible there won't be a lot of response, you never can tell. People do subscribe to feeds from there and femslash readers in particular seem to read across fandoms (probably because not as much of it gets written).

[shapinglight]

I do always post on A03 these days. My Spuffy stuff always gets way more hits than anything else. ;)

As for Darla, I think you're right about her in many ways, but I do think she has a big weakness (for a ruthless, evil vampires, that is) which is really what my story is about. But the weakness is part and parcel of her being a great survivor, of course.

She's a far more complicated character, I think, that she's usually given credit for being.

As to posting, there's not as much of a readership as there used to be for the fandom in general but I think there's still quite a few people who are interested in reading more about the Buffyverse.

There are (though most of them seem to be on Tumblr these says, unfortunately). I will try to post more when things occur.

[sibilant.livejournal.com]

I know what you mean about sex scenes in fic. More often than not, I skip them now, which I never used to do. Maybe my libido's declining. Or maybe there's only so many ways you can write sex and once you've read the stuff that really does it for you, then you're done.

I'm much more interested in character and plot now. And torture!

[shapinglight]

I'm the same. Except for the torture. I'm not only suffering from the declining libido thing, but also from increased squeamishness. ;)

[lokifan]

DO IT there should always be more Darla femmeslash.

[shapinglight]

Hooray! Yes, there should.

[feliciacraft.livejournal.com]

A few thoughts:

1) I like Darla, too. She's a complex character. Joss wrote her a redemption arc ending with self-sacrifice. He doesn't do that for just anyone.

2) You *always* say your writing sucks, but then when we see it, it's *always* brilliant. So at this point, I can go by past record and say, confidently, that I don't believe you. It's going to be just fine! :)

3) That is not to say that I don't take your writing whinges seriously. It's hard, I totally feel it too, but I really do believe that it's going to be OK. Just...don't stop writing. :)

[shapinglight]

Heh! Thank you. I tag these posts writing whinges because I know they're just whingeing - though it's perfectly true that when I've finished writing something I really do end up thinking it's terrible. I think that right up until a post it, even if my beta says otherwise. Then I go away. When I come back and re-read at a later date, I'm usually a lot happier with it. So far anyway. ;)

I agree about Darla. She is complicated. Which is another (though rather horrid) angle one could take with a Bangel fic, if one wanted, I suppose. Teenage Buffy is so much simpler and easier to please, no wonder Angel preferred her.

I don't think I'll probably write it, though.

[feliciacraft.livejournal.com]

Well, whinge away. We all do, in one form or another. :)

Fun fact about the word "whinge". It's exceedingly rare to see it used in the U.S. When I first binge-read Harry Potter in college and the first book said he lived with the Dursleys in "Little Whinging", it went right over my head. Wasn't until later that I caught on. ;)

[shapinglight]

Yes, I think there're a lot of Brit words creeping into American via books/TV etc. I can't believe there are many Americans left who don't know what 'wanker' means, whereas when Joss had Spike use the word, so I understand, it wasn't commonly known and that's why he got away with it.

[the-moonmoth.livejournal.com]

I've gone through phases of writing nothing for a couple of years and then writing lots. The inspiration comes and goes, I think that's normal :)

[shapinglight]

Yes, true.

I used to write a lot more than I do now, but I like to think what I write now is better. ;)

[snickfic]

More and more of the Buffy ships I actually am invested in these days (granted, in a fairly distant, nostalgic sense of the word investment) are femslash ships. Anyway, I am sure I would love to read some Darla femslash from you! I think thinking of it as your first femslash is the wrong way around - it's just a shippy fic with characters in it. It should be about them. That it happens to be femslash ought, I feel, to be practically incidental.

Best of luck!

[shapinglight]

Thank you. I think it's about ready to post now. I just need to find a beta.