(no subject)

[shapinglight]

So I was thinking about Angelus – what? I do, don’t you? – and remembering that when TGiQ was shown, there was a bit of an outcry about the way he was depicted in that episode – and about the way Spike was too, but not as much - although personally, all other reasoning apart, I was so sick of the ‘Spike the idiot’ stuff by then that it made a refreshing change to get ‘Angelus the idiot’ instead. However, be that as it may, and no matter how much I might enjoy (which is actually not as much as you might imagine) thinking of Angelus as this broodingly handsome scary bloke in leather trousers who might creep into your room at night and ravish you – well, ravish you and then kill you, more likely – it actually didn’t bother me at all to see him being portrayed as a bit of a stupid git.

This is because I’d already long come to the conclusion that he was vastly overrated in most ways anyway. I’ve always found it hard to believe that we were supposed to think he taught Spike everything he knows – although it seems he did teach him to ‘guard his perimeter’, which is all we actually know for sure that he taught him, and I could have taught him that – let alone that he’s so frightening and dangerous and ‘all that’ where evil’s concerned. I came to that conclusion after watching AtS season 4, and then thinking back to BtVS season 2 and realising that it all fit together rather well, in that Angelus was never exactly the man with the plan, was he? Or rather, if he thought of a plan, he was monumentally bad at sticking to it, unless it involved concentrating for only five minutes at a time. So, yes, he was great at fucking with Angel’s friends’ heads in season 4, but let him out of his cage, and he goes wandering off, stumbling into ever more absurd and unplanned situations, although of course looking very cool while he does it. He’s all: “Let’s kill Lilah, oh, wait, she’s already dead, let’s kill Fred then – oh, that didn’t work, let’s kill the Beast – oops, bad move – let’s kill Faith, booring! Damn, you caught me bang to rights. I give up, guv’nor, now shove that soul back in.”

No wonder Evil Cordy got so pissed off with him. Who wouldn’t? He didn’t have a plan, and even if he had, he wouldn’t have stuck to it.

And then in BtVS season 2, he couldn’t even stick with his idea of mentally screwing with Buffy until her head exploded. No, he got bored of that and decided to go with Dru’s wacky notion of waking Acathla and ending the world – but at least he looked good doing it, yeah?

So, no, I think Spike probably pulled himself up by his own bootstraps, though dazzled on the way just like everybody else by the Leather Pants of Evil, and that Darla was very definitely the brains of the Darla/Angelus operation, and that it was Angelus’s very own idea to try and get into the Immortal’s party using the name Blood Vengeance. I mean, I ask you!

Angel of course, is another matter. He does stick to things, which I suppose one must put down to a lot of brooding bringing maturity - because Angelus is far more like the original Liam than Angel is – and his plans are usually –except for what was probably the last one ever – much, much better.

This post has been brought to you by a break in writing the latest Furnitureverse story, which is a sickchicks production.

:Waves to flist and hopes to see them tomorrow:

Comments

[rahirah]

I think this points up one of the problems I've got in writing Angelus--who the hell is, he, really? I need my version to be capable of carrying out a plan, because otherwise he's far too easy to beat. He is, after all, just a vampire, and not even the oldest and strongest vampire out there.

[shapinglight]

He could probably carry out a plan for as long as it amused him, but no longer. Obviously, he got bored with Buffy in season 2 and found that whole Rain of Fire situation in season 4 of AtS too ennui-enducing for words.

However, we know that he was capable of spending quite some time killing all Drusilla's relatives and driving her insane, so that was obviously something he enjoyed well enough to plan it to some extent (although it was initially Darla's idea).

Do you mean you need him to plan an outright Evil Scheme of World Domination, or something like that? If so, I can why it's hard, because I don't see him being good at it at all.

[rahirah]

It starts out as a small, manageable plan of "Let's rebuild my vampire family, whip the Order of Aurelius back into shape, and incidentally teach Buffy and Spike a lesson for daring to forget that I'm the center of the universe" and get sidetracked into a plan of world domination when a really cool magical artifact falls into his lap. The planning part is easy. The hard part is figuring out believeable emotional motivation for a guy who's canonically unable to love or to hate his victims. What fun is that?

[shapinglight]

I don't know if this helps, but although incapable of anything approaching the human version of love, I'm sure that Angelus could be very possessive indeed of what he regarded as his property - and in fact, he'd have to be, wouldn't he, to want to fulfill the first part of his Evil Plan in your story. I could quite imagine him thinking that Buffy belonged to him - after all, he had her first and nyah! nyah! nyah! and all that, and Spike is family.

As for the world domination, the only possible motivation I could see canon Angelus having for wanting that would be because it looked like fun, and being in charge of things would give him access to All Fun All the Time. However, I'm sure that if he ever found that it was more work than he wanted, he'd get tired of it very quickly indeed.

That's probably not very helpful.

[bogwitch.livejournal.com]

I suspect the majority of vamps just survive day to day munching on people they've picked off the streets or working as a minion. The really notorious vampires are the ones who get up to evil for fun and commit the atrocities and massacres, because otherwise the populations wouldn't support them.

It wouldn't take that much really to build up a reputation that way, they probably take rather less planning than imagination. I've never seen Angel or Angelus as especially intelligent, but uses what he has. Whereas Spike is probably the other way round.

[shapinglight]

The really notorious vampires are the ones who get up to evil for fun and commit the atrocities and massacres, because otherwise the populations wouldn't support them.

Yes, makes sense. If they all had as high a body count as Angelus is supposed to have had, we'd all be vampires.

Yes, I suppose Angelus was all about the art. You don't need to be a planning genius for that.

[bogwitch.livejournal.com]

It dosn't take much planning to munch on nuns, just a handy convent.

[shapinglight]

Heh!

[itsabigrock.livejournal.com]

I like this take alot Deb! Of course I love Angelus most when he's laying on the ground with numerous arrows in him wondering if he's a bad bloke, lol. I don't think he ever so much considered himself 'bad', in fact I think he considered himself very good at the things he did, and that meant he was a good vampire.

I'm wondering if you'd like to turn this post into a short essay, or let me post it at CP&D as is. It's nice to have a take slightly different from 'Angelus is the root of all evil'.

[shapinglight]

I like this take alot Deb! Of course I love Angelus most when he's laying on the ground with numerous arrows in him wondering if he's a bad bloke, lol. I don't think he ever so much considered himself 'bad', in fact I think he considered himself very good at the things he did, and that meant he was a good vampire

Well, the Master seemed to think him pretty decent - all that 'the most vicious creature I ever met' and so on, and as you say, at least he has a sense of humour.

Please feel free to post this to CP&D if you would like.

[tehshiny.livejournal.com]

Yep, that pretty much summed it up. It was jarring seeing Angelus portrayed that way in TGiQ but the way you put it made it more believable.

[shapinglight]

It probably helps as well to think of him as being essentially a force of chaos. He may occasionally have a Big Idea, but he hasn't the patience to stick to it.

Like Spike, in fact. Oh, well, they say, like father, like son, don't they.

[tehshiny.livejournal.com]

I now see Angelus as a violent 5-yr. old. He wants to play, he plays. He has little patience and whines bitterly.

[shapinglight]

Sounds about right.