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shapinglightto misquote Joyce from School Hard, and with further mention of various thoughts I've had during my BtVS rewatch.
And I would've put all of that in the title of my post, but LJ wouldn't let me.
Anyway, yes. I'm supposed to be writing something for![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-community.gif)
seasonal_spuffy at the beginning of May, but have no ideas whatsoever. I suppose I should ask for prompts. Prompts, anyone?
I'm wondering when it was I became primarily a Spuffy writer (which has sort of happened by default, must admit, because even before the Buffy comics stomped all over the very idea, I didn't think Buffy meant the ILY in Chosen - not that she has to have meant it for people to be able to write Spuffy, but still...).
I think it must be down tosb_fag_ends as much as anything. I try (though I failed miserably last year) to produce at least one drabble or ficlet for the comm every month, and my fic ideas are so thin on the ground now that I don't have any left over for seasonal_spuffy.
:Gloom:
It's not just something forseasonal_spuffy I'm struggling with writing either. I had every intention of getting on with my abandoned Spangel story while S was away last weekend, but ended up writing a measly 1500 words that didn't advance the plot much at all.
I started the story in 2007 (I think). The part I'd already written had some bits and pieces of slashy stuff in it. I think I'm probably going to have to remove them wholesale.
This is because I'm finding it very difficult to even entertain the idea of Spangel these days, thanks to the comics showing the relationship between Spike and Angel as nine parts raging hatred and one part gay panic (on both their parts, but especially Spike's), not to mention when re-watching the Spike/Angel interaction in BtVS season 2 I couldn't for the life of me see where the dynamic between them, as so often written in old slash fics, ever came from in the first place.
There aren't many of the old slash writers around these days, and the ones that are're probably not on my flist, but if anyone has an opinion on the subject I would be quite interested to know what they think that dynamic was based on back in the day (you know, the sire/childe stuff, which I freely admit to enjoying a lot at one time, not to mention writing it myself). Was it based solely on the fact that Spike originally said Angel was his sire and people just took that and ran with it, and then people read their stories and a huge body of fanon developed which lots of people confused with canon, or what?
Returning to the subject of me not being able to write anything, sadly, much though I'd like to put it down to disillusionment with fanon tropes, I'm afraid it's far more down to me just being out of ideas. I can't work out how the plot of this Spangel fic should go forward to the end I envisaged for it (at least I do have an end envisaged), and generally writing is just all hard and stuff and makes my brain hurt. :(
:More gloom:
And I would've put all of that in the title of my post, but LJ wouldn't let me.
Anyway, yes. I'm supposed to be writing something for
seasonal_spuffy at the beginning of May, but have no ideas whatsoever. I suppose I should ask for prompts. Prompts, anyone?I'm wondering when it was I became primarily a Spuffy writer (which has sort of happened by default, must admit, because even before the Buffy comics stomped all over the very idea, I didn't think Buffy meant the ILY in Chosen - not that she has to have meant it for people to be able to write Spuffy, but still...).
I think it must be down to
sb_fag_ends as much as anything. I try (though I failed miserably last year) to produce at least one drabble or ficlet for the comm every month, and my fic ideas are so thin on the ground now that I don't have any left over for seasonal_spuffy. :Gloom:
It's not just something for
seasonal_spuffy I'm struggling with writing either. I had every intention of getting on with my abandoned Spangel story while S was away last weekend, but ended up writing a measly 1500 words that didn't advance the plot much at all. I started the story in 2007 (I think). The part I'd already written had some bits and pieces of slashy stuff in it. I think I'm probably going to have to remove them wholesale.
This is because I'm finding it very difficult to even entertain the idea of Spangel these days, thanks to the comics showing the relationship between Spike and Angel as nine parts raging hatred and one part gay panic (on both their parts, but especially Spike's), not to mention when re-watching the Spike/Angel interaction in BtVS season 2 I couldn't for the life of me see where the dynamic between them, as so often written in old slash fics, ever came from in the first place.
There aren't many of the old slash writers around these days, and the ones that are're probably not on my flist, but if anyone has an opinion on the subject I would be quite interested to know what they think that dynamic was based on back in the day (you know, the sire/childe stuff, which I freely admit to enjoying a lot at one time, not to mention writing it myself). Was it based solely on the fact that Spike originally said Angel was his sire and people just took that and ran with it, and then people read their stories and a huge body of fanon developed which lots of people confused with canon, or what?
Returning to the subject of me not being able to write anything, sadly, much though I'd like to put it down to disillusionment with fanon tropes, I'm afraid it's far more down to me just being out of ideas. I can't work out how the plot of this Spangel fic should go forward to the end I envisaged for it (at least I do have an end envisaged), and generally writing is just all hard and stuff and makes my brain hurt. :(
:More gloom:
no subject
Date: 2015-03-30 06:55 pm (UTC)Yeah, he does, but I firmly believe that Joss never meant that to be more than Spike claiming Angel as his mentor. Or if it did, Joss had changed his mind as early as Lie To Me only a few episodes later. In that, Angel confesses to Buffy that he sired Drusilla and describes what he did to her at great length, but he never mentions Spike. I just feel that if he'd sired Spike too that would have been the moment he would have mentioned it. Likewise, in that episode he meets Dru and tells her to 'take Spike and leave Sunnydale' which comes across to me as him thinking Spike is far more Drusilla's responsibility than he is Angel's own. I dunno. I just think that if there was a retcon it happened a long time before FFL.
They were very wedded to what they thought was his back story based on S2-S4.
Yes, which, as a Brit, never made sense to me. I'd read all these people describing Spike as a 'Cockney' and wince. He doesn't sound Cockney at all.
Not that this figures either way, obviously. The show wasn't being made for Brits.
it appeared that the writers were writing Spike as Angel's love interest. Actually they were - that was the intent, albeit not in the sexual context (well depending on the writer).
Yeah, I do remember Joss (I think it was him) saying that Spike was the best 'love interest' Angel had ever had in the show, though I don't think he meant it literally (and also think it was a bit insulting to Charisma Carpenter).
Whedon went so far as to piss off Marsters by calling him the ingenu - what he meant was that Spike was being introduced as the guy that Angel hates at the beginning but ends up closest to at the end.
I don't think that's what Whedon meant by 'ingenue'. In theatrical terms, an ingenue is a female character who is endearingly innocent and wholesome (like Fred), which is why JM was so insulted to be called that. But I think Whedon probably meant that Spike was a naive outsider in the W&H set up.
Plus Spike and Angel had excellent banter in S5. They fought like an old married couple.
There are definitely elements of that later in the season. I love the scene at the beginning of AHitW where Spike has stuck a sword through Angel and Angel is complaining about it. Very funny.
no subject
Date: 2015-03-31 03:56 pm (UTC)Yeah, I do remember Joss (I think it was him) saying that Spike was the best 'love interest' Angel had ever had in the show, though I don't think he meant it literally (and also think it was a bit insulting to Charisma Carpenter).
Yeah, I think people tend to take writers' words a little too literally. I'm pretty sure I've heard one of them say S5 is a Buffy-Dawn love story. Obviously it was meant in the familial sense.
That was the vibe I always got from Spike and Angel up until S5, the heavily antagonistic brother thing. I have to agree the S5 stuff really came off as bone-throwing.
no subject
Date: 2015-03-31 04:19 pm (UTC)Oh, definitely. All of the Spike/Angel parts of TGiQ are bone throwing, though very enjoyable for all that.
Spike's 'that one time' comment does make the 'ship canon, though. I guess Joss thought it couldn't do any harm, given that the show was about to end.
no subject
Date: 2015-03-31 04:26 pm (UTC)Yeah, I think he's fine with stuff as long as he doesn't have to write it. See also: Spuffy post-S6.
Definitely just a gift to the fans which I don't mind. Maybe it's 'cause I still always see the author. I just think some fans go way overboard with analysis.
no subject
Date: 2015-04-01 06:39 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2015-04-02 05:24 pm (UTC)My take: I'll stop taking the writer into account when they stop putting 'written by' on things. :P
no subject
Date: 2015-04-03 12:08 pm (UTC)